Rene Ernst Lippe
( - 28 Aug 1774)

Rene Ernst Lippe  (,  Germany  - 28 Aug 1774,  Montréal, Québec, Canada )  
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Rene Ernst  was the child of ?

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Is this him? Ernst Rene LIPPE, full name: Phillip II, Ernst, Count von Lippe Alverdissen, Germany. There is a theory that this is person who was a prince in Germany, came to Quebec, faked his death in 1774 and assumed his proper place on the throne in Germany.

NOTE: There is also a theory that this Rene Lippe is not the Rene Lippe above and that he died 26 AUG 1774 and was buried 28 Aug 1774 at Anglican Christ Church in Montreal. Is this a different person or was this his faked death date?

See http://www.francogene.com/gfna/gfna/998/qrd30.htm
"A searcher pretends Ernst is the same as Philipp II Ernst Lippe, a German prince. The problem is this claim is based on a secret document. Moreover, the signatures of the immigrant and the prince are different."

On the other hand...
In May 2007, I received an interesting email from a man named Simon from Quebec. He is also related to Rene Ernst Philipp Lippe (married to Françoise Fuseau). He told me that a historian from Montreal is working on "something that would explain our Germanic and royal roots. Ernst Lippe was supposedly a German Prince who came to Quebec to escape from his party... This historian's wife is a Lippe and some of his related familly own many artefacts from this Prince (watch, rings etc) and they have the royal crest on it!"

Opinion Denis Beauregard (roughly translated from French to English), see http://www.francogene.com/dossiers/lippe.php for original

After some discussion with Mr. Beaudin, we finally learn the identity between Ernst and René LIPPÉ, innkeeper came to Quebec in the early British regime, and Count Philipp Ernst II Zur Schaumburg-Lippe based on secret documents that it can not make them public (this after 300 years). Until other genealogists read fluent German of that era have not seen the documents in question or that has no other public records to confirm this identification, it will consider this identification as speculative and not founded.

I note that it is difficult to assess this issue. For example, the author said that Lippé came as a spy for the German government while at the time, Germany is not a single country but a multitude of small principalities. He reportedly fled Germany because of court intrigues and because he was in danger, but I do not see how it would be a spy on someone who wants to get rid of. The documents would be kept secret because the German family in danger of losing his fortune, but this fortune dates from the industrial era, ie after 1800. Burial of 1774 would be a tactic to hide the return of the count in Germany. The moot point too many seem to be able to accept this relationship without having evidence very strong.

This site has a lot to say on the subject, all written in French -- http://www.afogq.com/pdf/cahier-16.pdf
Its conclusion is roughly translated from French to English below:

Conclusion
Lippe family Lippé or continues to exist today in Quebec, Ontario, France, New England and, as stated in the family, also in Germany. An important question, not yet elucidated, the relationship of Quebec with Lippé family Schaumburg-Lippe, Germany. The Prince William of Lippe Biesterfeld had come to Quebec to meet with the notary Alexandre Lippé, to 1900. By 1930, there was the visit of the Prince and Princess Adolf of Schaumburg-Lippe in Quebec and meeting with Lippé? Better access to documents, which are mainly Germany, might help to answer such questions and to clarify the nature of the relationship between the two families Lippe, German and Quebec.

The mystery lives on... One thing seems pretty certain, Ernst Rene Lippe was German.



NOTE:
Would love to see this...


Table of contents Biographical note Summary Browse

Title La famille Lippe - Lippé - : mille ans d'histoire, deux siècles en Canada / Pierre Beaudin
Author Beaudin, Pierre, 1937- [5] Alphabetic list
Publisher Montréal : [s.n.], 1975 [56037]
Description 16 p. ; 26 cm
Notes Titre de la couv.
Tiré à part de: Mémoires de la Société généalogique canadienne-française, vol. xxv, no 4, 1974
Bibliogr.
Subjects Lippe (Famille) [1] Alphabetic list
Ernst, Philipp II, comte de Schaumburg-Lippe, 1723-1787--Famille comte de Schaumburg-Lippe [1] Alphabetic list
Source QMBN
Bibl. entry number 0000571310

Ancestor's Life Events

29 Sept 1765   License granted to Ernest Lippie to sell liquor in Montreal Source: http:/www.afogq.com/pdf/cahier-16.pdf

29 Sept 1767   License granted to Ernest Lippie to sell liquor in Lavaltrie Source: http:/www.afogq.com/pdf/cahier-16.pdf

15 Feb 1769   Montreal Ernest Lipe of Lavaltrie, Inn-keeper, licensed to keep a common ale house for one year. Signed: Ernst Lippe Source: http:/www.afogq.com/pdf/cahier-16.pdf

10 Apr 1771   Montreal Ernest Lippie of Lavaltrie licensed to keep a public ale house for one year Signed: Ernst Lippe Source: http:/www.afogq.com/pdf/cahier-16.pdf

Ancestor's Marriage(s) and Child(ren)

married Marie Françoise Fuseau dit Roch -- Date: abt. 28 Apr 1763 Place:  Lavaltrie or Montreal, Quebec, Canada Source:  Le Programme de recherche en démographie historique - Univeriste de Montreal  PRDH has no record of this marriage, however there are records of the baptisms of their children, the first one in Lavaltrie in 1767. Rene Lippe and Marie Francoise Fuseau Roch

Family Group Record for Rene Ernst Lippe and Marie Françoise Fuseau dit Roch

Children: Jean Rene Ernest Lippe (29 Apr 1764, Montréal, Québec, Canada - 7 Feb 1855, L'Assomption, Québec, Canada) Andre Lippe (abt. 1766, Montréal, Québec, Canada - 5 Apr 1840, Sainte-Geneviève-de-Berthier, Québec, Canada) Joseph Sulpice Rene Lippe (12 Oct 1767, Lavaltrie, Québec, Canada - 21 Apr 1857, Lanoraie, Québec, Canada) Marie Elizabeth Lippe (14 Apr 1769, Lavaltrie, Québec, Canada - 22 Aug 1849, L'Assomption, Québec, Canada) Alexis Lippe (2 Apr 1770, Lavaltrie, Québec, Canada - 4 APR 1770, Lavaltrie, Québec, Canada) Benjamin Nicolas Lippe (21 May 1772, Lavaltrie, Québec, Canada - 18 May 1819, Lavaltrie, Québec, Canada) Marie Louise Judithe (Julie) Lippe (28 Oct 1774, Lavaltrie, Québec, Canada - 28 May 1851, L'Assomption, Québec, Canada)

Added: 12/16/1999 12:00:00 AM - 1

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(Messages / Memories / Questions / Additional Information About Rene Ernst Lippe)

The comments you read here belong only to the person who posted them. We reserve the right to remove off-topic and inappropriate comments. Also, If you'd like to be contacted by others who are related to Rene Ernst Lippe, leave a message here!

Rene Lippe is my 4th great-grandfather. My 2nd great-grandfather, Jean-Baptiste Charland married Marie-Anne Lippe, grandaughter of Rene Lippe. I am currently working on a book on my Charland line and will be including a major section on the Lippe line. I have quite a lot of Lippe information, including as number of notary records from the 1700s. I would be pleased to share information on the Lippe line. I am particularly interested in obtaining an example of the signature if Phillip II Ernst in Germany to compare it with his signature on Canadian records. For what it's worth, my gut feeling is that his death record is an example of someone "papering the file". (More on this later.) cnygr1@twcny.rr.com 10/26/2011 10:47:12 AM

I'm a descendant of Ernst Lippe and Francoise Fueau-Roch. I have been working on a book on a branch of this family. (My mother's name was Cecile Lippe) I'd like to hear from anyone who may be related. Henri LeBlond Henrileblond@Cox.net 2/13/2012 1:19:48 PM

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